FoB List discussion thread

[Fujin]

Hey Nick,

Cheers for your work. Try not to remember the next week of bitching/moaning/whining/complaining if someone asks you to be a TO again next year.


Dave

[Fodderboy]

Dealing (or not) with the whingefest is pretty much a given, regardless, isn't it?

[Fujin]

And retaining experienced and patient TOs isn't pretty much a given, is it?

[Fodderboy]

Sadly, that's true. You stand as an obvious example.

I didn't post to defend those who throw chuck their toys on a regular basis.

Well considered opinions are one thing. Jumping up and down trying to get your way should have gone out of fashion by the time we left kindy.

[Vaul]

Having talked to nick on the phone last night, and had numerous e-mail conversations with several attendees, I would say that he is taking it rather well.  Last night was a bit of a bombshell for a lot of people i'm afraid to say. 

Today i've been doing what I can to talk at least two people into not asking for their money back after they got vetoed (which they immediately wanted to do), I think the judges are doing their best to make some fair decisions and with a bit of teamwork and understanding we can really save this tournament from facing some hard feelings.

- Luke

[Fujin]

Sadly, that's true. You stand as an obvious example.

Aha - not so (quite). I'll be back in action for FluffyCon 2011!

Where's the Zorro emoticon? Swish swish!

[pete dunn]

How many lists received a veto (and resubmit)?

[Josh]

I'm very surprised there are tends to be thoughts of a player pulling out if their list gets vetoed. There is no way that being asked to tone it down a little (and advised how to in this case which is great) would ever insult me to the point that I'd consider ditching a weekends gaming with the best in the country. I've been looking forward to Fields of Blood for months!

Anyways I'm sure Luke can attest to the benefits of sticking with the competition even if it means you suffer some overall negative points. It's going to be an awesome weekend! It will all be worth it

[wouster7]

I think we shouldn't over react to most of the hints that are thrown around by some members on this forum.

" oh I've seen all the lists and by god they are filth..."

A: What you've seen your mate and you mums list. That really constitutes 2 lists not a few.

" oh I've had to consul at least two people about their vetoed lists and probably everyone-elses as well..."

A: We shouldn't panic and yet again a few comments form the same member has almost caused mass hysteria. I think we should all just sit back and not subscribe, as I'm sure the TO has it well under control.

[warpmaster]

Hey all ,any chance i could get sent a copy of the army lists that will be attending FOB

[Fodderboy]

Hey all ,any chance i could get sent a copy of the army lists that will be attending FOB

As our fab TO posted earlier, everyone will get a copy of every list once every list has been accepted.

[warpmaster]

As our fab TO posted earlier, everyone will get a copy of every list once every list has been accepted.

I'm assuming that its only for those attending,which i'm not but would still like to have a gander at them.

[Dirty_Vod]

don't be a tight arse 

No entry = no access to the lists 

[Big D]

No, Cupped Hands has nothing on Throne of Vines. I personally think that if Slaan + Lore of Life gets through, the rest of the list had better be tame. Could you post your list Big D, I'm curious now...   how many dispel dice/scrolls does it have?

Runelord: +2 dice, Anvil: +1 dice, MRo Balance: take one of your PD and make it a DD. So effectively in the the eyes of the panel, +5 dice.

Have now dropped the Mro Balance and taken 2 dispel runes instead.

And I also take this opportunity to apologise to Nik and the panel. While I still don't agree with them, it is their call and my attitude last night was out of line. Just the shock of getting my first veto  I guess.

[SKELATOR]

so nick has everyone been told , if there lists have been veto ?

[Derick]

I haven't heard anything So I guess my Slann with knows all LIFE spells/No 6's to you/Etheral with Cupped hands and obsidian Amulet, 3 stegs and unit of 12 kroxies must've got through

[Big D]

I haven't heard anything So I guess my Slann with knows all LIFE spells/No 6's to you/Etheral with Cupped hands and obsidian Amulet, 3 stegs and unit of 12 kroxies must've got through

Actually, that Slann I like. Being Ethereal, he cannot join a unit, so will take maybe 2 magic GT shots to kill it. 

[Derick]

I haven't heard anything So I guess my Slann with knows all LIFE spells/No 6's to you/Etheral with Cupped hands and obsidian Amulet, 3 stegs and unit of 12 kroxies must've got through

Actually, that Slann I like. Being Ethereal, he cannot join a unit, so will take maybe 2 magic GT shots to kill it. 

Obsidian amulet gives him +3 magic resistance which takes his ward save to a 1+

[Big D]

Not vs runed up Warmachines it doesn't

[Fodderboy]

MR only stacks with wards for spells, not magical attacks.

Does this mean you're going to resubmit, Derek?

[Josh]

I haven't heard anything So I guess my Slann with knows all LIFE spells/No 6's to you/Etheral with Cupped hands and obsidian Amulet, 3 stegs and unit of 12 kroxies must've got through

Actually, that Slann I like. Being Ethereal, he cannot join a unit, so will take maybe 2 magic GT shots to kill it. 

Well, not really. 1/3 will scatter away (assuming runes and whatnot), 4+ look out sir, 4+ ward save, 5 wounds... more like an average 12 shots to kill him. That's a long time for him to cast dwellers, etc... me thinks Derick pulling legs though 

[nik_]

And I also take this opportunity to apologise to Nik and the panel. While I still don't agree with them, it is their call and my attitude last night was out of line.

Thank you, that's really appreciated.

Just the shock of getting my first veto  I guess.

It seems to have come as a shock to many of the players who received an email from me.
To let the rest of the world know, the emails were exactly this:

"
Subject: Fields of Blood - request for list change

Hi,

The judges have scrutinised all of the lists, and have decided that while the majority of the lists are fairly tough, some lists contain elements that deviate from the guidelines enough that we think they are inappropriate for the event.
Consequently we are asking a number of players to make modifications to their lists so that hopefully the playing field is a bit more level.

<Information about which things in your list broke one or more guidelines, information on how to modify your list to keep it fundamentally the same but more closely aligned with the guidelines.>

Any questions, please ask

Cheers,

Nick"

I did my best to word it in a positive/neutral fashion, and not make players feel like they were getting 'vetoed'.

For whatever reasons, the majority of players who received that email have responded in a negative fashion and asked to be withdrawn from the tournament. That is their choice.

The judges are aware that this is very early days in 8th, and our views in 12 months time might be different, but we’ve done the best we can today to level things out and ensure that the majority of players enjoy their event and play against lists that are of the level outlined in the players pack.

As for 'vetoes', yes, I believe I have sent out all the emails that I need to. When the outcome of this process is complete, I will be able to send out the lists to players.

I would request that once you have all seen the lists, you keep any negative opinions on those lists to yourselves or offline. I think it is a double blow to players who are asked to resubmit their list as well as being publicly mocked on the forum.

Thank you all for your patience

[Vaul]

No, Cupped Hands has nothing on Throne of Vines. I personally think that if Slaan + Lore of Life gets through, the rest of the list had better be tame. Could you post your list Big D, I'm curious now...   how many dispel dice/scrolls does it have?

Runelord: +2 dice, Anvil: +1 dice, MRo Balance: take one of your PD and make it a DD. So effectively in the the eyes of the panel, +5 dice.

Have now dropped the Mro Balance and taken 2 dispel runes instead.

And I also take this opportunity to apologise to Nik and the panel. While I still don't agree with them, it is their call and my attitude last night was out of line. Just the shock of getting my first veto  I guess.

Darryl,

I'm not 100% hopeful that this will make you feel better, but my grudge opponent for round 1 has pulled out of the entire tournament because the same guys that vetoed you also said he couldn't use an arch lector + wizard lord, given that he'd have good magic + extra dispel dice... or something.... DON'T QUOTE ME, not a comp judge, i've been a bit carried away with second hand info and rumour mongering lately (for which I apologize unreservedly).  He submitted the same list to 7th Ed FOB '09 but with only a level 2 wizard, and scored the lowest battle points of all 64 players (and with great comp), pretty much.  Not easy for a person in that situation, having not played a huge amount of new games in 8th, to appreciate why his list is suddenly considered right at the opposite end of the comp spectrum.

Point is that we're seeing a comp crackdown the likes of which have not been seen in a long time.  This has really struck me by surprise, and as Rion remarked to me lately things have really been creeping up and up since Natcon etc, with players really taking what they want and judges not lifting a finger.  While part of me feels that this is fantastic, you've also got to feel for all the many players who never dreamt of receiving a veto, and are still in shock, not really understanding.

Not all of us have been able to 'read between the lines' of the players pack, which to be fair isn't - and couldn't have been - as clear and definate as we all would have liked, nor have we all been able to practice for 8th as much as we would have liked, and had enough time to understand what is powerful and what isn't.  My only hope is that we don't have a tournament where a number of people are getting in with a finely tuned, optimal list for 8th, with all the '8th ed red flags' present, but fitting in snuggly with the pack 'firm caps', while other people remove the offending factors of their own lists, resulting in fluffy submissions that were already fluffy if not for the offending factors, now devoid of anything to threaten the big guys.

But we're in reasonable hands - the team understand what a fair playing field is meant to be like, admittedly more so than myself, and from what i've seen there have been good attempts to communicate with players involved in this unfortunate revision process.

- Luke

[richardbarby]

how many players are coming now if a few have pulled out late on?

[Josh]

You're doing a great job Nick! Regardless of this, that or the other, I firmly believe all players who attend are going to have a real blast. It's sad to hear of some wishing to pull out... they're going to miss an awesome weekend!

[that guy the Master]

@ Nick, thumbs up

@ Big D, don't stress the high magic defense. In BeerHammer big chunks of units get taken off, through magic, and artillery. That is the way it works now. Save your 50 points worth of scrolls for something killy instead.

[Derick]

@ Nick, thumbs up

@ Big D, don't stress the high magic defense. In BeerHammer big chunks of units get taken off, through magic, and artillery. That is the way it works now. Save your 50 points worth of scrolls for something killy instead.

@Nick - you still have your fingers, use them

@Ant - Leave D alone if he wants to fight defensive and hide behind stuff let him. Playing points denial is a valid tactic, it also means he has less options to do any damage to me
Those stunty legs can move a bit quicker now.

[Fodderboy]

@Nick - You can't please everyone. What you can do is run this thing in as fair and reasonable manner as possible. As we all know, you're on the sharp end of it because it's a new ruleset and one of the first tourneys worldwide. Sure, we all want to win. But I think we want to have a good weekend more.

As long as I don't nova my lord on a 2-dice IoN more than 3 times, I should be sweet

@Derek - D's dwarves run as fast as they do because I told them your Slaan was sitting on a keg.

[Bignic]

Nick - you only have to do this once and then you can give up -  like many TOs have done in the past. Kia kaha.

I blame teh interweb.

No audience = less angst

N

[Vaul]

Did everyone read jervis' article in which tournament organisers are told that comp isn't needed in 8th ?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=cat440002a&categoryId=500004&section=&pIndex=2&aId=12400020a&start=3