Guardcon Fantasy Ruleset - 7th or 8th?

[omegakai]

For  example some untis from 7th to 8th maybe become sub optimal choices, or change standings IE go from core to special. This may mean several people will have to paint mountains of troops with only a few weeks to buy, assemble, and paint.
Examples of such changes in the past would be sliver helms, going from an optimal core choice, to a sub optimal special.
Pretty much everything hard in the chaos rule book went from core to special, who’s not to say we won’t see repeats of these, you won’t be able to accurately gauge the impact of the rule change until you see the finished product.

Changing units from Core to Special or similar is not something that will happen with the rulebook, unless they doa complete reset like they did with ravening hordes. Those changes only come from new Army books so this arguement is irrelevant.

I challenge you to find anyone with 100% clarity and understanding of 7th ed as it stands now. 99% of players will be all over the new rulebook like white on rice.We always are. Those that don't buy it will borrow it, download it, photocopy it.

The only balance issues will come if there are major changes to game mechanics (ie magic before movement) and these will be immediately obvious and will indeed be shouted from the rooftops by GW upon or before release giving us plenty of time to adjust to them.

from what i here D they are reseting it.  I a little baffled by your response in regards to your last portion, they only thing that will change....
How about fear, as a VC player if fear no longer autobreaks your troops then end up being  absolutely over priced.

[Josh]

So no one else thinks that going back to 7th ed after playing 8th for 2 months will be stupid?
Call me crazy, but I think this is all a storm in a teacup anyway.

[omegakai]

If by everybody you mean everyone that plays as much as you do, lives as close to a major city and or store, and reads these forums, then yes... yes you are right.

I’m not saying 8th ed is bad blah blah blah, I’m saying I think its too close to FOB, which is unquestionably the most premier WHFB event of the year.

[Big D]

Actually Rion, I said balance issues will come if there are major changes to game mechanics and gave 1 possible example that has come out in the rumors to date.

However, 2 months will be more than long enough to get our heads around them and adjust accordingly.

[Dirty_Vod]

Haven't read the whole thread (my time is far to valuable to waste time on what other people think  ).

I would think that this is an easy choice - assuming that 8th ed is going to be released at least 1 month before the event 8th ed should be the version that we use. Simple.

[wouster7]

I would think that this is an easy choice - assuming that 8th ed is going to be released at least 1 month before the event 8th ed should be the version that we use. Simple.

I came across this quote and I couldn't help but share with you folks.

" Simple is never simple to the simpleton... It becomes advanced..." 

[Dirty_Vod]

I would think that this is an easy choice - assuming that 8th ed is going to be released at least 1 month before the event 8th ed should be the version that we use. Simple.

I came across this quote and I couldn't help but share with you folks.

" Simple is never simple to the simpleton... It becomes advanced..." 

In other words you're saying that everyone who disagrees with my point is a simpleton?
A bit harsh, but ultimately fair...

[wouster7]

In other words you're saying that everyone who disagrees with my point is a simpleton?
A bit harsh, but ultimately fair...

Now we see where the 'Dirty' came from 

[Simon]

While the new BRB may be 500+ pages, 350 of those will be hobby related as usual.

ha, true. I am not too worry about the contents, i'm more worry about the price..

double the thickness = double the price??

$190 for a rulebook.. ouch...

[Fujin]

Cue associated arguments about not all players being able to afford to buy the new rulebook

[Neil Williamson]

If you look at Warseer there is heaps of uniformed speculation of what the extra 300 pages are going to be filled with ranging from and through to:
1. A typo
2. Extra background fluff.
3. Lots of diagrams and pics to explain the rules in given situations
4. Catalogue of miniatures.
5. "Ravenening Hordes" get you by lists until new army books come out
6. Complete army lists with no more army books to come.

Or I suppose - any combination of them.

If you feel a bit bored - go and check it out.

Of course it could be that some health fanatics have infiltrated GW so we have to carry around the extra weight of a 500+ page rulebook, have special large and heavy dice to lift and throw, 6 foot wide tables so we have to stretch our backs to reach the troops in the centre, and 300 pages of warmup exercises before our games. Gosh we are going to be a fit lot.

[grumpy old smurf]

and a 100 will need to be faq'ed.

[Fujin]

If you look at Warseer there is heaps of uniformed speculation of what the extra 300 pages are going to be filled with...
1. A typo

I know you meant the "300 pages" might be the typo but I instantly thought the 300 pages might just be filled with typos.

Lol

[Derick]

I've seem some publications with faulty bindings before.
Sections repeated and bound upside down, maybe they did a whole run like that?

[Bignic]

I am very keen to play 8th edition at FOB.

If it depowers something, anything, somehow - it cant possibly be bad.

We are assuming that the rules are competition-friendly though. Imagine if it is all scenarios with unbalanced points and no gradated scoring system. Victory conditions might be around holding the spaceport area of cultural significance whilst killing the enemy's most expensive unit or whatever - making it more of a win/lose/not much in between sort of game.

N

[dave grant]

I won't be going, but if I were I would assume, as an attendee, it would be 8th ed.


Went to FoB when 5th ed 40k came out and had a great time - even though I had never played 5th ed.

Worse that will happen is there will be a few rules discussions / people losing cos they didn't know a new rule.... which is of course what happens under 7th anyway.

Last event I know of over here using 7th is the ETC on 7th August, one event the week after is going to let those that buy a ticket vote what edition they want to use, after that - its 8th all the way.

[Fodderboy]

I will be attending tournaments I can because I want to play.

All tournaments have caps and special rules.

If I don't like the caps because they nerf my favourite combo, I harden up or find a workaround (Uncle Gribbly for the 50% win rate!)

If I don't like the rules because I haven't had enough practice with them to make them work for me, I have to get off my butt and get more games in.

Somebody is going to have to have some kahunas and make a decision. And the earlier they make the decision the better.

I'm Bill, and I endorse this sentiment.

Go 8th. Someone is going to have to. Might as well be the exalted CG!

[Big D]

I draw everyones attention to the following thread on WAU:
http://www.wargamerau.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=94544&st=0

and ask the enevitable question: As 8th ed is a "Clean Slate" as it were, do we go no-comp as they suggest to really see whats what with the new game, unclouded by 7th ed pre-conceptions?

[pete dunn]

I don't have a problem with that, given a number of caveats:

• No Special Characters
• No Duplicate Rares
• No Triplicate Specials

[Philfy]

I don't have a problem with that, given a number of caveat:

• No Special Characters
• No Duplicate Rares
• No Triplicate Specials

Fixed 

[pete dunn]

Hi Nick,

Has there been a decision for Guardcon?

Regards

Pete

[richardbarby]

put it to a secret vote on players going email the people running 7th or 8th

if you make it a secret ballot the loudest voice is not the most powerfull and you all get a fair say

[Big D]

What vote? Democracy is fatally flawed. Niks TO, he makes the call. Then everyone makes a choice. Have a fun weekend with little toy soldiers or sit at home like a friendless loser.  I'll be there either way.

[richardbarby]

to be honest its  his bat and his ball 

[Josh]

Interestingly there's a discussion on WargamerAU (as I'm sure some of you are aware) regarding edition use in upcoming tournaments. Similarities are being made to a tournament over there a couple of years ago (I forget which one it was) that ran about 4 weeks after the release of 7th ed. The tournament was run in 6th ed as the organisers thought the time frames were too close. After the tournament players were asked if they would have preferred the tournament to be in 6th or 7th. The vast majority said 7th would have been better. As Simon and others point out, however, the difference between 8th and 7th is rumoured to be far greater than 7th to 6th. Despite that, I'm sure as long as plenty of warning is given to people entering, there will be no problem using 8th. I think that playing the old system after weeks of learning the new rules will be annoying and confusing. It probably also pays to think of new participants too who may have never even played 7th ed.

Food for thought

[Fujin]

And while the book isn't out and we aren't 100% clear on all the rules changes and intricacies, thanks to some research and info from Simon (at least for this forum; and contributions of other posters on other forums), people are starting to talk about 8th edition now, reconsider implcations for armies and lists, get a head-start on how the game has changed. So the preparation for changing the mindset and approach of players is already well underway.

[Ry.S]

I'd say that's true dave, I think most people are up set by the %'s I would suggest that the TO's look at changing this. A simple fix for instance would be to make people take 25% core max 25% for special and rare and if they want dragons/stegs/furnaces/level 4's ect that they would have to take the points from special and rare making sacrifices ect other side is that some people also segesting moving to a higher points limits.

[Fujin]

Erm... dunno about that mate. If the rules end up being percentage caps for characters/rare etc then we're probably better off sticking with the rules as they're written and hitting it up cold turkey.

The community will have to just accept the possibility that there may be a reduced number of players this year. Unless everyone who plans onattending has a number of different models to represent different character options for their force or they have the foresight to prepare for such (possible, only rumoured, merely speculated) changes well in advance (with the associated purchasing and painting of additional Core choices likely required to off-set less spending on characters).


I know if I had to use my Dwarf or Empire armies I would be able to enter the event. Lucky for me the Vampires are getting a lot of love right now and a whole bunch of different character options are getting the brush treatment And I know some very generous individuals who can lend me some models if things get extra tricky.

[nik_]

Has there been a decision for Guardcon?

8th. More info following this week.

[grumpy old smurf]

WOO FRIGGIN HOO! good stuff on making that call. well done all involved.