WHFB Beastmen

[Derick]

Does anyone in the club have a Beastmen army?

and how you seen the new book?

[Ant]

Yes I do......and the new book has got me motivated to start playing them again.

For me the jury is still out on the book.
Losing chaos marks [esp chaos undivided and its reroll for leadership tests is a big loss]. Similarly I hate losing dragon ogres and the new ambush rule is only good for a few throw away units [ie units of five skirmishers] etc. Losing demons also makes the list less interesting... ..

On the plus side;
[1] I like ungor raiders - its nice to have some cheap shooting [actually any shooting!]
[2] The new monsters might be fun.....I'm still experimenting.
[3] Minos are finally Strength 5 , but more expensive - bloodgreed can be quite good.
[4] Primal fury is fun every now and then...

Haven't tried the magic yet so can't comment

[Fujin]

Mate Minos are nuts. When you watch three Minotaurs roll up 21 attacks you start to feel very queasy indeed!

[warpmaster]

Book fluff is crap,but the rules are well written,unlike the skaven book.I don't think we will see a 8 page faq on this one.

I've been playing beastmen since 1988 and they are by far my favorite army,the real children of chaos.

After i had gone through the book a couple of times i got the feeling of a rush job.Almost everthing in the book is over priced is some way and alot of the magic items are a double edged sword.This doesn't mean that the list can't be built into a good competitive army.

I wrote a small review of the list that i took to Dark Shadow Rising here if your interest

http://www.chchwargaming.org.nz/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6365

If you have any other question I'm happy to answer them

[Derick]

I had a beastman army, last edition.
I was running 3 Beastigor units, 3 ungor/gor units, Shaggoth, Dragon ogres and Minotaurs.
The Centigors were crap, I sold mine to a friend who converted them into Wild riders. (They worked well then)

[warpmaster]

Bestigor are just terrible now.There 12Pt's which is the same as the last book but are now a special.Alot people say they should have stayed as core but i don't think that would have made a difference,what should have been done is just give them an option for shield or a extra attack.

Centigor are a great unit IMO,Drunkenness isn't anywhere near as bad and for 125Pt's you get 10 Star 5 attacks with possable hatred.That's a bargain in my book

[Dirty_Vod]

Mate Minos are nuts. When you watch three Minotaurs roll up 21 attacks you start to feel very queasy indeed!

21?  is that all 

In my game with Ant this afternoon 3 Minotaurs (HW&Shield)+ doombull (axes of khorgor) were up to 43 attacks by the end of the game!

The doombull had 13 by himself.

[richardbarby]

not knowing the rules how do they get so many attacks

[Dirty_Vod]

Everytime Minotaurs win a round of combat the whole unit gets +1 attack EACH.
I won 6 rounds of combat so all 4 models in the unit got +6 attacks each...

[richardbarby]

they really need shoting right from turn one

[Dirty_Vod]

yep that's why I had 3 units of them and 2 large gribbly monsters, you can't shoot everything right...

[richardbarby]

no not really has it made beastmen any better to use now or was that part of there general rules from there last ed

[Dirty_Vod]

Minotaurs are the best part of the list but it's hard to make an all comers list that can deal with some of the better books out there.

Don't expect to run into an army with a solid magic and/or shooting phase and expect to walk out of the other side unscathed.

[warpmaster]

What two big monster did you use Tony?

[Antony]

Against sticky units once the minos "charge up" they are really 'orrible. Think about it, 31 attacks from three models WTF?

I don't rate them much better than Ogres though. More rubbish units to spoil charges, 'nails characters and monsters, but Achilles heels of leadership and limited flexiblility in the games phases. A Vod army has even less flexibility with all of the "ctrl V" that was going on on Saturday night with his army list  

[Dirty_Vod]

What two big monster did you use Tony?

Jibber-Jabber and Gorgon

Gorgon died when it got hit by a full grail bus + bsb, but the jibber-jabber paid for itself big time with its area effect, terror and beating up a warmachine + other bits and pieces in combat.

[Dirty_Vod]

Darren - I just read through your posts on the ChCh thread and tend to agree with most of what you said.

The Doombull and gorebull are just nuts combat characters I kitted mine out with

Doombull - axes of khorgor & regen armour (parked him in a minotaur unit with champ wearing the blakened plate so he always gets a 4+ save).

Gorebull - bsb, Hvy armour, shield, sword of might, ramhorn, gnarled skin (1+ save wth a "free" s5 attack for every wound he saves)

I'd like to be able to fit in a chalice of darkrain to protect from shooting but didn't have enough character points to go around :-(

Totally agree on you view of the ranked infantry, there's absolutely no point in wasting points on the Gor/beastigor/ungor ranked units - they are over priced and just don't cut it for there points.

I'll try swaping the ghorgon for a cyclops next time, being able to walk to within 1" of a unit and then dropping a rock on it sounds like fun 

[warpmaster]

Doombull - axes of khorgor & regen armour (parked him in a minotaur unit with champ wearing the blakened plate so he always gets a 4+ save).

I haven't tried the doom bull out yet,just because he very pricy(too pricy IMO)

Gorebulls are ace value as a bsb.

Having another game this Sunday VS Darkies which i havn't been able to beat yet so might give the doom bull a run

[Ant]

Vod.......What characters did you use in addition? no magic? Was the doombull your general?

I found the doombull overkill in the game i played...and Im not sure I want my general frenzied?
I also used the gorgon [who went ok...and the cyclops who didn't do much for me and who sucks when in combat. I will swap him out for the jabber and see how that goes.

Unlike you I found having two units of twenty gor to be effective. Xtra hand weapons [and hopefully rolling up hatred] can be alot of fun. They are something that I will persevere with.

[Dirty_Vod]

The other character was a L1 scroll caddy.

Rest of the list was filled out with 3 minotaur units, 2 gribblies, 2 chariots and 30pt units of hounds and raiders

[warpmaster]

What do you think of pumbas Tony?

[Fujin]

The other character was a L1 scroll caddy.

Rest of the list was filled out with 3 minotaur units, 2 gribblies, 2 chariots and 30pt units of hounds and raiders

Sounds like what I'd expect the 'standard' Beast list to become. Except you haven't taken a unit of Harpies.

[Dirty_Vod]

oh yeah I forgot about them, I had a scouting unit of harpies too 

[Big D]

Your standard point-n-click build then, totally ignoring the bitz that make beasts what they are and removing any need to think tactically or use any real skill on the tabletop.

[Josh]

Note to all: Minotaurs only pursue D6 inches. Not being told that until after a crucial point in the game (i.e. setting up the perfect bait/flee/flank/win) with the frenzied unit cost me a big win at Natcon. Only the second time in my life I've sports hit someone. Gorgan is nails in combat, Jabber dies to a stiff breeze but is thoroughly annoying until then.

[Derick]

Note to all: Minotaurs only pursue D6 inches. Not being told that until after a crucial point in the game (i.e. setting up the perfect bait/flee/flank/win) with the frenzied unit cost me a big win at Natcon. Only the second time in my life I've sports hit someone. Gorgan is nails in combat, Jabber dies to a stiff breeze but is thoroughly annoying until then.

Its a bit like playing against a hidden list isn't it, only he knows what is in you list.
 S*Head)Oh yes, I forgot to tell you I have an assassin in that unit
 You) I didn't see an assassin in your list
 S*Head)That's because he was hidden

[Dirty_Vod]

Your standard point-n-click build then, totally ignoring the bitz that make beasts what they are and removing any need to think tactically or use any real skill on the tabletop.

Have you ever played an army with Ld6/7 with no armour, no static CR, no ranged damage threat, and very little magic defense?  Remind me again why the monsters + skirmishers beastman army is broken and doesn't require any skill or tactics to use on the table top  

as for it ignoring the bitz that make beasts what hey are - absolutely my army has no Gor or Beastigor units in it.  I suggest that you get used to it because they are some of the least worthwhile infantry units in the game on a point for point basis.

[Ry.S]

It would take skill to use vs some army's but others like undead would be in for some real problems.

[Dirty_Vod]

unless the undead army had wraiths and a banshee...

[James.M]

Note to all: Minotaurs only pursue D6 inches. Not being told that until after a crucial point in the game (i.e. setting up the perfect bait/flee/flank/win) with the frenzied unit cost me a big win at Natcon. Only the second time in my life I've sports hit someone. Gorgan is nails in combat, Jabber dies to a stiff breeze but is thoroughly annoying until then.

Wait, you sports hit someone because you didn't know their armies special rules??... Did you at least ask them if they pursued 2d6 or did your opponent imply they did? because otherwise....W ow....