Dave Stent vs Nick Irvine

[Vaul]

Good looking armies, great generalship... what more could you want.

p1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYWeMla3Gpo
p2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OwsBPJiPbY

Below:  I shake my fist at thee!

[Fujin]

Good looking armies, great generalship... what more could you want.

I reckon we both have the right to ask for better dice

Cheers for the report Luke... a luxury to be able to watch ones army implode. Such nostalgia.

[Fujin]

Hehehe... I see one Pete Dunn gathering intel 

[pete dunn]

Excellent report Luke....very enjoyable watch.

Intel, Dave? Haven't you noticed the infestation of mice at your place over the last few weeks?

[Fujin]

Oddly enough I've recently become somewhat addicted to a Facebook game called Mousehunt. Coincidence? I think not!

[Ry.S]

Sigh Nick letting the Kerikeri long shots down.. or where you letting him have the win? Being the nice person you are 

[Derick]

Oddly enough I've recently become somewhat addicted to a Facebook game called Mousehunt. Coincidence? I think not!

You bastard!
I looked up Mousehunt on Facebook and got addicted 

[Chris]

Oddly enough I've recently become somewhat addicted to a Facebook game called Mousehunt. Coincidence? I think not!

Amusing, my Mrs makes me play that one so she can win at something :p.

[nik_]

Sigh Nick letting the Kerikeri long shots down.. or where you letting him have the win? Being the nice person you are 

Nah mate, that was all him (and a handy couple of failed terror tests!). I did win one the week before so there is still some hope If I get completely pwnd at Runefang on the weekend I might have to reassess things... and repaint those dryads...

[Ry.S]

All most makes me wish I had a wager on them being dusted off and on the table by the end of the year.

[Fujin]

It'll happen. Nick will come to his sense sometime around Saturday night/Sunday morning. Waywatchers are GOOD - but are they that good???

[Philfy]

*mutters under breath about &#$& waywatchers*

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

*mutters under breath about &#$& waywatchers*

Now some race's would think dwarfs silly for constantly mining and living underground, but then again not many survivours are left after entire forests (waywatchers and other pesky elves included) are blown up from underneath.

Hhhm, that would be cool, blowing up parts of the battlefield using bombs laid before/during the battle. Say maybe D6,S6, flaiming hits everything within the range of a artillery dice, costs lets say 25pts per charge. (So you thought your RBT's were safe didn't you?)

"Bring your pretty face to my axe!"-Gimli son of Gloyn.

@Fujin: why did you not take any cold one kights? What do harpies cost and do they have any sort of save?

[Fujin]

@Fujin: why did you not take any cold one kights? What do harpies cost and do they have any sort of save?

I had ONE practice game that included a unit of Cold One Knights and a Cold One chariot. In that one game I managed to fail three Stupidity tests, so they're not units I would define as reliable. After chatting to a couple of mates who play DE, one in particular who used them with great success at NatCon but was constantly placed on the back foot due to Stupidity, I elected to go the safe route and avoid them altogether.

Harpies, bless their little cotton socks, are a bargain at 55pts for 5. They have no save, are liable to air-swing (miss) in combat, and have exceedingly poor leadership. They are also absolute gold if used well. Wouldn't leave home without a couple of units - incredibly versatile, mobile and annoying.

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

Whoa, failed stupidity test three times.   

Are harpies a core choice, do they cause fear? I am asking so that I can sort of have more information to decide what I need to shoot down first when playing DE.

[nik_]

I think they are core but don't count for your minumum core. They don't cause fear, they really are individually quite poor, but from recent experience I can tell you that they are amazingly annoying and can really take control of the game away from you, which is always a bad thing.
For example, in this game, they chased down some fleeing Glade Guard, marchblocked my general while she was trying to escape being shot at, and forced my Eternal Guard to hold against a flank charge from Black Guard when I would rather have fled.
Great unit for sure, and definitely higher on my shooting priority list after that little lesson I got from Dave.

[Josh]

Yeah, harpies. Great value, and multi-use, but almost completely worthless vs TKs, VCs and Demons. I'd take a unit, but probably not more than 2.

[Simon]

still good against VC, march blocking

[Glenn Patel]

Even against TK's, having cheap expendable fliers to just throw in the way is an irritating trick. Plus they can war-machine hunt - they can use the General's Leadership now, right?

[Fujin]

Yes they can use the General's leadership.

Against TKs, VCs and Daemons they are still excellent march-blockers, redirectors, and in a pinch if you can keep them back, last minute table quarter occupiers. As Nick has mentioned their annoyance value is immense - highly entertaining for the DE player at least.

[pete dunn]

The good thing is you've made concessions by only taking two units of them 

[Fujin]

Dark Elves aren't about "concessions".

I've themed my army by taking things that are "excessive" - that's entirely in the character of the race. Sheesh... if anything this army should be getting a standing ovation for being so fluffy thanks to all the excess I've managed to pack in there 

[pete dunn]

Dark Elves aren't about "concessions".

Every now and then someone just says something that is so true it's just magic

[Fujin]

Found what I was looking for... a quote from another thread (and forum) discussing Dark Elves:

with tier comp and DE, its very very hard to get +1 and difficult but not impossible to get +0. You'll find most competitive DE lists are getting -1's/-2's under the latest check list (such as all of andrew galea's lists he's used in major events).

With DE now sitting at the lowest possible tier, and -1 being a standard competitive DE tournie list, you just got to realise that you'll be sitting very low in comp regardless, so might as well take the combinations that'll get you those points + some back. Don't make too many concessions - the +0 isn't worth it - you'll lose more BP than that.

That + knowing my limits as a player = Dark Elf list I'm taking to Runefang II. In this particular game Nick's Wood Elves were WAY softer than my army but to me this represents a challange I've not yet encountered due to usually taking soft armies - having taken a (probable) comp hit I need to work REALLY hard in the game to get top battle scores. As a naturally defensive (and self-admittedly somewhat hesitant) player this has forced me to adapt my play-style ergo improve my generalship. I definitely don't plan to use the army long-term but as a short-term experiment it's been incredibly rewarding!

Now in every game I play I'm looking with a very keen eye to figure out where the easiest and at the same time most expensive enemy units are while simultaneously being ultra-cagey with my elite but incredibly fragile (and costly!) units. It's affected my deployment habits (much less reactive now), how I view and use terrain and the overall level of agression (especially forcing my opponent to make harder decisions) in my play. I reckon that's a good thing!  


Really looking forward to our game tomorrow morning Pete - fingers-crossed there are no flight issues this time and we'll see you around 8:30am.

[Fujin]

Dark Elves aren't about "concessions".

Every now and then someone just says something that is so true it's just magic

I have my moments 

[Josh]

Re Harpies vs Fear causers. My real point was that they lose vast amounts of effectiveness against undead/demons.

Uses:
March blocking, (minimal effect, esp if the enemy is TK or magic heavy)
Re-directing, (sub-optimal compared to fast cav)
Warmachine hunting, (have to hang out by the general are really unlikely kill a SSC in a single turn anyway)
Destroying fleeing units, (no fleeing)
Combo charge to prevent a flee reaction, (no fleeing)

Yes, they're good and that's why I'd take a unit. But I don't think that taking more than 2 units would be more beneficial as they'd end up being free points to your opponent.

[Glenn Patel]

If a unit with a 20" move gets killed, it's because you didn't move them out of harms way, and presumeably had a plan in doing so...

Then again, what do I know, I don't run 'em at all. 

[Philfy]

I think your gameplay has improved immensely over the past 18 months Fujin...  helped in no small measure by the various armies you have been using and the way you have been approaching the game...  good luck for the weekend  (OMG I just said that to a DAVE!  *falls over in fits of revulsion*)

[Antony]

Re Harpies vs Fear causers. My real point was that they lose vast amounts of effectiveness against undead/demons.

Harpies are the biz. One of the most useful units in the game. Two units or more of harpies and tow units of fast cav will have your opponant tied in knots in no time. In this edition allowing Harpies to use the Boss's ld means that they can still perform admirably against undead.

I think your gameplay has improved immensely over the past 18 months Fujin... 

Twice nothing is still nothing though right 

good luck for the weekend

and from me, and the falling over too

[Fujin]

Thanks lads. All your well-wishing and voodoo netted me 24th. Ace