Philfy Drops The Dragon *gasp*

[Philfy]

No don't worry...  not literally    In fact the second one is still on the painting table... who knows...  might field two dragons at a tourney one day for a laugh. 

Anyway...  new year, so a new list for the HE's...  looking toward Tin Soldier and possibly Runefang, and given that at this stage (due to odd player numbers) I'll be playing at Natcon, then for that as well...  And NO dragon!

Okay people...  you can settle down now 

Here's what I am looking at...  having now happily converted some DE's into WL's...

Prince
White Sword
Armour Of Caledor
Guardian Phoenix
Talisman Of Loec

Noble (BSB)
Elven Steed + Barding
Sword Of Might
Helm Of Fortune
Gem Of Courage
Dragon Armour + Shield

Mage (Lvl 2)
Seerstaff Of Saphery
Dispel Scroll

Mage (Lvl 2)
Tricksters Pendent
Dispel Scroll

RBT x2

Great Eagle x2

White Lions x12
Muso
Standard Of Balance

Swordmasters x7
Bladelord

Dragon Princes x6
Muso
Banner Of Sorcery

Tiranoc Chariot x2

Spearmen x18
Full Command
Lion Standard

Archers x12
Light Armour.

6 + d3 PD
4 DD + 2 Scrolls


Spears in 3x6 formation...  WL's in 2x6 formation...  should be competitive, challenging and fun to use!  Oh and oppose as well  hehe.  Haven't actually fielded a BSB EVER before with HE's...  so that will be fun...  Prince on foot is something different for me as well.   

[Antony]

No dragon makes a huge difference!

What do those special items do? White sword, standard of balance...

Strong magic and shooting, decent amount of infantry (although still small units).
Plenty of standards, lots of stuff to go for. Flufftastic.


Cudos for you

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

Where are your RBT's? Are the WL your centre (can't say anvil for an elf list  ) with the spearman and sword masters as flankers?

I also agree that it is a good list.

How do you plan to sort of overcome or negate your low numbers, when playing against fear causing armies? Those two lv2's  and some archers can mean that a good number of the enemy get to you.

[dave grant]

Spearman + WL are immune to panic.

White sword is great weapon + Killing blow. Combined with Loec = dead stuff.

There are 2 RBTs

[Philfy]

White Sword as Dave says, GW + Killing Blow

Talisman of Loec gives one round of re-rolls in regards to attacks, wounds and saves - taking a wound after the phase

Standard of Balance makes my unit & any other unit in b2b immune to psych, and nullfies frenzy & hatred permanently (if that unit comes into b2b with the WL)..  will be funny vs DE's in particular.

Tricksters Pendent means if an opponent miscasts, they roll twice on the miscast table and I pick the result that stands *teehee*

Spearmen aren't immune to panic, but are immune to fear/terror.

Numbers aren't actually THAT low for a HE list with 70+ models on the table - as I noted on the WAU posting of this White Lion Chariots would be "preferable" thanks to their immunity to fear and hard-hitting capability - but points limitations and lack of having any painted negate taking them.

I'm happy that the army competes well in all phases - which is what I usually like to aim for with my lists.  Its certainly a friendlier list than my Dragon-led one, but less hard hitting in one go obviously and certainly not as "tuned".  Although not really any "wastage" in the army either... can't afford to do that with HE's IMO.

A few thoughts...

SM's operate best in units of 6-7 in single rank. I have been an advocate of them that way since the book came out... and others will agree. Spears fielded 3x6 will give optimum usage combat wise, and the WL's at 2x6 given maximum combat effectiveness with a little stubborn sustainability (esp since immune to psych with banner), and yet at the same time don't become too much of a point sink. DP's I'd field usually at 6 including character, so there is some leeway there for dropping one of them and putting that 30 pts to work elsewhere... but DP's being 7 wide inc character leave leeway for losing one or two and retaining combat viability.

Chariots in pairs. Always. Never field just one. Ever. Period.

2 Eagles + 2 RBT's. Standard HE kit.

Archers fielded at 10 - 12 means the unit doesn't become an unwieldy width (esp with only the single unit rather than 2 units of them) in regards to deployment and LoS. Also gives a nice sized rank if deployed on a hill. Light Armour not many take... but partly because of having armoured archer models, and partly because 1! 6+ save made pays for the armour for the whole unit, and 2 saves makes a "profit" makes it consitently worthwhile IMO (and in most games I make at least 1 save)

I am trying a somewhat different setup with my mages than I normally do... and I havent' seen many people using the Tricksters Pendent, which looks to be amusing (for me)... not sure how effective it will be, but will make people doubly wary of miscasting - which is a good thing quaiff? Esp Vamps... and when you have a Drain Magic or two in play to stop them using one dice to cast... you get my drift I hope *chuckles*

If it doesn't play out I'll happily take the comp hit for swapping out the pendent and scroll in favour of my usual build of Ring of Fury + Silver Wand.

If I were to drop any of the magic items it would be the Gem of Courage... but then the only thing it is replaceable with is an additional spearman...  so it might as well be left in.

Standard comp on tier is what I am aiming for with this list.

[nik_]

Looks like a Wood Elf list Philfy, well done
Glad the title isn't for real...

[wouster7]

Sweet Philfy!
Good to see that you have forsaken the DoC for the mo n bringing the HE's out.

Looks to be a solid all round list. It's quite similar to mine so I'm guessing you'll know its vulnerabilitie s as well.

Never really thought standard of balance was worth it, but be keen to know how it works for ya.

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

Standard of Balance negate unbreakable as well?

[Philfy]

Sweet Philfy!
Good to see that you have forsaken the DoC for the mo n bringing the HE's out.

Looks to be a solid all round list. It's quite similar to mine so I'm guessing you'll know its vulnerabilitie s as well.

Never really thought standard of balance was worth it, but be keen to know how it works for ya.

The Elves are painted.  The daemons have a ways to go.

Standard of Balance rocks - used it under the previous book too.

Grutnik - no it just negates Hatred & Frenzy permanently, and makes both the unit carrying it and any unit in b2b immune to psych

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

Tricksters Pendent means if an opponent miscasts, they roll twice on the miscast table and I pick the result that stands *teehee*

- "Tricksey elves!!" Gortrek Gurnisson (Elfslayer)

Chariots in pairs. Always. Never field just one. Ever. Period.

-Why did you take the normal chariots over the ion chariots? I mean two fear causing chariots. Come on. 

[Philfy]

[
-Why did you take the normal chariots over the ion chariots? I mean two fear causing chariots. Come on. 

For an extra 55pts each?  And its not the fear causing thats important in regards to Lion Chariots, its the extra high str attacks + being IMMUNE TO FEAR and hence able to charge at will.

The thing is...  that extra 55pts a model, in an army that already lacks for spare points/numbers is a huge difference.

And added to that, I don't have any painted - and those chariots may be nice...  but they are a pain in the back side to paint.

[Simon]

hmmm.. general on foot.. interesting.

[nik_]

You could upgrade the chariots by dropping the eagles. I'm not sure how important they are to an HE army. Just paint the lions and attach them to tiranoc chariots

[Fujin]

hmmm.. general on foot.. interesting.

Agreed. I like this a lot Phil - looks like it requires more "skill" and forward planning to get this guy in the right place at the right time.

Do you have a particular model in mind (or already finished) for this and a reason (aside from 'points are scarce' - which is a good reason!) why he's not mounted on a horse?


Great points about the Lion Chariots. Immunity to Fear is really a bigger boon than the ability to cause Fear.

[Philfy]

White Sword = Only can be used by a model on foot.  Hence General on foot

Eagles - 50 point unit in a HE army?  Gold!  Diverters, march blockers and even mage assasination tools (if ONLY they had 3 attacks and two wounds instead of 2 attacks and 3 wounds..  oh well).    I likes my eagles

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

I likes my eagles

Grrr, them overgrown budgies are the bane of every artillery man in the known world.

If you fought a horde army like O&G, skaven or empire, you would probably be at an advantage, because it will be easier to get points out of your opponent. However, against a horde army how do you plan to last six turns when outnumbered at least 5-1?

[wouster7]

Grrr, them overgrown budgies are the bane of every artillery man in the known world.

Yeah they always forget to shoot it, oh the irony 

However, against a horde army how do you plan to last six turns when outnumbered at least 5-1?

I usually bring a deep fat fryer. It's called phoenix something...

[Philfy]

If you fought a horde army like O&G, skaven or empire, you would probably be at an advantage, because it will be easier to get points out of your opponent. However, against a horde army how do you plan to last six turns when outnumbered at least 5-1?

I'm pretty sure thats what the Persians asked the 300... 

[Gratnuk Ironfist]

If you fought a horde army like O&G, skaven or empire, you would probably be at an advantage, because it will be easier to get points out of your opponent. However, against a horde army how do you plan to last six turns when outnumbered at least 5-1?

I'm pretty sure thats what the Persians asked the 300... 

Yeah I suppose so, but remember that the 300 were spartans. These are elves, the only army in warhammer that can outrun and out-chicken skaven slaves. (Especially WE)